Thank You Sir for your service and sacrifice you gave to our Country! Despite our brief conversation enroute to the tanker about pilots who had ejected from their burning airplanes prematurely (their aircraft flew on for long distances before going out of control) what happened next got my attention. It is awful that people make bad decisions for selfish reasons. Glad you made it home safe after 6 years in the north. Dinh . Joe, Many thanks for writing & publishing your story. We were to be a flight of four F-4C Phantoms. Never flew with a pilot in the USAF that was not a top notch professional. 71-0316 (355th TFS) operational loss (non-combat) crash in Thailand on 11 January 1973 (pilot rescued) 70-0949 (354th TFW) shot down Laos on 17 February 1973 (Maj J.J. Gallagher rescued) 71-0305 (3rd TFS, 388th TFW) shot down in Cambodia on 4 May 1973 (1Lt T.L. By The Associated Press. In closing, I assert that Joe did not have the option you recommend. Global Security, "A War too Long: The USAF in Southeast Asia 19611975", http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/virtual_disk_library/index.cgi/1025775/FID1977/NAVY/Chap_3.pdf, USMC HELO LOSSES(19621973) by aircraft type, "The OV-1 Mohawk Remembered Firsthand: Piloting the Mohawk in Vietnam", "SE Asia and Vietnam: Royal Australian Air Force", "Image Galleries 2009 - Department of Defence", " - - www.skywar.ru", U.S. Air-to-Air Victories during the Cold War, Wars in Yugoslavia, and Anti-Terror War, Widow travels to Vietnam after 40 years and finds her MIA husband's Marine Corps F-4 jet crash site in Que Son Mtns, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_aircraft_losses_of_the_Vietnam_War&oldid=1133364112, First loss: A-1E 52-132465 (1st Air Commando Squadron [ACS], 34th Tactical Group [TG]) shot down during night training mission on 29 August 1964 near, Final loss: A-1H 52-139738 (1st Special Operations Squadron, 56th Special Operations Wing) which was shot down 28 September 1972 (pilot was rescued by an, First loss: 710310 (355th Tactical Fighter Squadron, 354th TFW) on 2 December 1972 shot down on a, Final loss: 700945 (354th TFW) shot down in Cambodia on 25 May 1973 (Capt Jeremiah Costello KIA), First loss: B-26B 44-35530 (Detachment 2A, 1st ACG) shot down in IV CTZ on the night of 45 November 1962, killing the 3 crew, Final loss: A-26A 64-17646 (609th SOS, 56th SOW) lost over Laos on the night of 78 July 1969, killing both crewmen, First loss: AC-119G 52-5907 (Det.1, 17th SOS, 14th SOW) which crashed on take-off from, Final loss: AC-119K 53-7826 (18th SOS, 56th SOW out of, First losses were operational (non-combat) mid-air collision 2 B-52F 57-0047 and 57-0179 (441st Bomb Squadron, 320th Bomb Wing), 18 June 1965, South China Sea during air refueling orbit, 8 of 12 crewmen killed, Final loss: B-52D 55-0056 (307th Bomb Wing Provisional) to SAM 4 January 1973, crew rescued from Gulf of Tonkin. I later learned that this controller had served many months in Saigon. A MiG-21 of the VPAF which became the primary fighter-interceptor against USAF and USN aircraft. The time was 1151. Secondly, everybody else all the other strike flights, 15 of them, one after the other were calling, Outbound for weather meaning the target area was socked in and it would be just plain stupid to drop into the clouds where it would be hard to locate the target and easy to get nailed by a SAM (Surface-to-Air Missile). But, I stuck to my story answering the same question in the same way each time. The other Marine brought a lit match to the cigarette hed placed in his mouth, and as soon as he did, ZING, a bullet went through the Marines helmet and skull. During the tour at NKP Thailand, I had opportunity to go TDY to Ubon Air base. The first morning mission was "Misty 11" would be replaced by "Misty 21" then "Misty 31" and . for my family and I, is absolutely heartfelt and sincere. Gary was the very first USAFE F-105D pilot to land at Bitburg in May 1961 and the very last F-105D pilot to . God Bless America; God Bless the USAF; God Bless the Pilots and God Bless the POWs! The flight call sign was Dogwood and we were number 2. May God bless you, your family and all our vets. Our brand-new LtCol had dreams of a DFC or Silver Star, so we drove 250 miles or so North, with marginal weather at Chu Lai, to volunteer our (his) effort. Million-dollar wound some would call it through the knee, with the bones barely nicked. His remains were returned September 5th 2004 for burial. On 3 January 1969 Light Attack Squadron Four (VAL-4) was commissioned at NAS North Island, California and after an intense period of training was transferred to Vietnam. Source for F-4 losses is Phantom with U.S. Marine Corps (Joe Baugher), others are unsourced, Production of a total of 380 Mohawks ended in December 1970. North Vietnam, pre-1975: Killing of Two American Pilots Shot Down Over North Vietnam IIR Casualty files | William A. Ott. Twenty-one aircraft carriers conducted 86 war cruises and operated 9,178 total days on the line in the Gulf of Tonkin. It was moving and changing shape ever so slowly. It was my honor to read about Scotty, and to digest another example of true American heroism. The eight-engine bomber was brought down by a North Vietnamese surface-to-air missile near Vinh on the day when B-52s flew their heaviest raids of the war over North Vietnam. I was a bit young to be drafted for Vietnam but as a flying geek and guy who likes to learn about military history, Ive had conversations with many people involved in that conflict, including soldiers, marines, airmen and my brother, a draftee who walked point in the US Army in Vietnam. VMFA-115. Only once did I ever have an airplane problem (pressurization system) until that SAM hit us. Thank you Sir. He still had the baleful look of an owl about to gobble a mouse. First loss: 560937 (476th TFS, 497th TFW) shot down by enemy ground fire during CAS mission near Tri Dao, Vietnam, on 29 June 1965, pilot Capt. He didnt shoot at anyone. If it means anything, I wanted to tell you that I have travelled extensively though Vietnam for both work and pleasure, and found that Vietnamese people hold no grudge whatsoever to those dark years, younger generations are full of optimism and only look forward for a better life. Final loss: A84-228 shot down by two SA-2 SAM missiles on 14 March 1971; Wing Commander F. J. L. Downing and Flight Lieutenant A.J. b fearnits people like you ( and others who fled to Canada) who make those of us who answered the call sick to our stomachs! They did not want to lose their Skin in this deadly game while other Americans bravely went to war. But, knowing this might be my only chance to talk before the fun and games began anew, I concocted a mission scenario that I hoped would be accepted as truth. I was escorted a few hundred feet to one of the village hooches Id seen from above. I was asked the same questions over and over in an attempt to trip me up. The USAF sustained approximately 0.4 losses per 1,000 sorties during the conflict, which compared favorably with a 2.0 rate in Korea and a 9.7 figure during World War II. With the helmet strap no longer in existence, my helmet flew off like a slingshot. Outwardly grateful to Jesus Christ above all and to our United States military service members is the way of life I choose to live and pass on to my children. Of course, things were beginning to wind down in Viet Nam by this time, but it was still mega impressive to see the F-4s light em up and blast off the runway like angry rocket-powered birds of prey searching for their next meal! And after Scotty started the engines, the aerial refueling receptacle would only operate some of the time. GlobalSecurity, South Viet Nam Air Force VNAF Aircraft Deliveries. How many MiGs were shot down during Vietnam War? Yes, it is tainted with much uncertainty to which you allude. Day after day intel would ask us to listen up for Buick 4, or Chevy 4, or whoever Number 4 who had been shot down while lead worked on getting his Mig. During this relatively minor ordeal, I asked permission of my guard, using sign language, for permission to relieve my bladder. Its a tough story to take. At 10,000 ft, the automatic man-seat separation features operated exactly as advertised. Only loss: 606058, destroyed on the ground during a VC attack on Tan Son Nhut, SVN on 14 June 1968. In addition to the roof, the toilet was destroyed! His first pass was- G D- Chief, 200 long. I was way back in trail, tree top, plenty of time to do 2 football fields short. The Army and USAF spent enormous efforts preparing to fight WWII over again in Europe (this time with nukes). Of all those shot-down pilots, the experience apparently only made one uniquely qualified to be President. In 1973, American POWs finally came home. Just as we were positioning ourselves for the right-hand turn at Bravo, the lead aircraft unexpectedly turned to the left. 1F-4C-1, Change 1, page 2-20) before reaching 30 knots below calculated nose wheel liftoff speed. In fact all those who kept us in the air were. I confirmed this by dialing in Bravos coordinates and the needle pointed straight ahead. Did a Korea tour also when enlisted. A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing he values above his own personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of men better than himself.. My hats off to those who served. Glad to hear you are on frequency. I think of Scotty Wilson and many others every, single day. 17, 1965, Commander Lou Page (pilot) and Lieutenant JC Smith were flying F-4B bureau number (buno) 150646 not 151488 as sometimes reported. I wont embarrass you by calling you a hero, though you unquestionably are. Every living Veteran will no doubt support such. In the solitude of my tiny enclosure, staring unfocused at the floor, I said aloud, Todays the day, thinking this was the last day of my life. Model names were normalized in 1962 to UH-1s. 28 NOV 67. The cockpit pressure vessel was intact; incredibly, it had not been penetrated despite a direct hit by a Soviet SA-2 missile traveling at over Mach 2 with a 400 lb., high-explosive warhead! God bless you, Sir. Ill never understand your sacrifice, but want to thank you for it! This farmer pilot is Nguyn Vn By who died on Sept. 21, 2019 at the age of 83. For the next two hours I ate dust, dirt, rust flakes and rodent droppings as we pounded our way over the worst rutted roads into Hanoi. Thank you for your expressions of gratitude, sir. Had the great fortune of knowing 2 Navy POWs who were at the Hanoi Hilton one of which my wife served with in the Navy. Joe, I fly a POW/MIA flag below Old Glory everydayin honor of you, Scotty, and all the other heroes that sacrificed so much in that war. By now it has been a long while since the conflict in Viet Nam. While the Vietnamese and Chinese have a long history of ethnic combat, the Chinese were happy to limit both Russian and American military influence in SE Asia, by replacing every bullet fired by North Vietnam. I always get chills reading these stories. At least 68 people were killed Sunday when an aircraft went down near the city of Pokhara in central Nepal, a government official said, the country's deadliest plane crash in more than 30 years. Hes my hero. As for Mr. Fearn, Politics aside, we probably did back the wrong side. Joe, Every Friday Im privileged to have lunch with a WWII veteran who flew virtually every airplane in the arsenal of the time. Im thinking, How does anybody know how their INS is doing when they cant see the ground? We were at 25,000 feet above a solid, 10,000-foot undercast. My head, no longer protected by my helmet, was now receiving direct hits from clubs, rocks, rifle butts and God-knows-what. And I mourn their deaths. Im glad you made it home. There are plenty of other places to rant and vent. I do not think that you are a hero.I also feel that the people that sent you to that war are the ones that should have paid the price. Fighting against such a cruel political regime didnt seem that bad an idea after all, did it? There will always be those who dont get it. Dogwood 3 had already arrived and was taking fuel through the KC-135s boom. A year and a half after his plane was shot down over North Vietnam, Porter sat in a filthy cell shared with another American prisoner of war, and learned that he was supposedly dead. Shot down. He called me to come back coming out of a Split S spin. Public Servants who screw -up Big, Big time do not deserve such glorified recognition. You need four for effective mutual support; i.e., lookout coverage for all four in all quadrants. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling that thinks nothing is worth war is much worse. Flight lead arrived and took his fuel after we were finished. At this point, because of the unexpected turn, our formation was too bunched up; we were too close to each other to be able to provide mutual look-out support. What could I possibly say to the President of the United States that he hadnt already heard 334 times before? It was proving a good day for Navy Lt. Randy "Duke" Cunningham, and his back-seat. Bent the F-4 around after re-start and headed to his radial fix off Hue Tacan. How many f4 were shot down? First loss: Canberra A84-231 disappeared on 3 November 1970 on a night bombing mission in the northern 1st Corps Tactical Zone region of. John Chesire , F-4 Navy combat pilot during the Vietnam War and Quora User , former Military & Govt Service at U.S. Air ForceAuthor has 633 answers and 913.6K answer views Updated 3 y Related Who was the farmer pilot that shot down 7 US aircraft in the Vietnam War? A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing he values above his own personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of men better than himself. First loss: EC-121R 67-24193 (554th Reconnaissance Squadron, 553d RW) crashed 25 April 1969 on take-off in a thunderstorm from. Sayonara, engines! Suddenly, I was lifted from the floor. Im horrified to know how divided our country was in the late 60s/early 70s, and people like you did your duty, for all of us. As I descended lower and lower, I realized that by the time I reached the surface Id still be a long way from even the base of the higher ground. I received my draft notice right after I joined the USAF. April 16, 1968 : C-130A 56-0480, c/n 3088, of the 35th Tactical Airlift Squadron, crash landed at Special Forces Camp Bunard, 80 kilometers north of Bien Hoa, South Vietnam. 17 apr 1966: arab 511, an a-1h (buno 135398), lt (jg) william l. tromp, va-115, went down following a night attack on coastal targets, near approximately 1818'n, 10610'e. arab 506, his wingman,. Good lives were wasted for what? Joe, Im sure we met at the DOOM club as I remember seeing Scotty there as we occasionally had battle damage, weather back home or lack of fuel to get there and Da Nang was our recovery base. Thanks for the compliment on my writing. The clouds were reported to be at 10,000 ft. By that point the airflow over the isoclinic horizontal stabilizer was sufficient to start the nose up. Lt Cmdr Frederick P Crosby had been deployed on the Bon Homme Richard, an Essex-class aircraft carrier stationed off the Vietnam coast His planed crashed in 1965 in front of Pham Van Truong's. I wish I could have expressed my thanks to your Elder Eagle for successfully completing his mission to spring me out of jail. The United States, along with their allies (The Republic of Vietnam, South Korean, Australian, Thailand, New Zealand), lost about 12,500 aircraft, helicopters and UAVs. I remember their faces were not contorted with anger or hatred but rather with kind expressions of understanding almost bordering on a smile. Looser! I imagined the instrument of death: a bullet, a knife, a shovel, hammer, pick, axe At that moment, I felt a long, cool piece of steel slide between my throat and my helmet strap. John Stuart Mill Cliff, I am very sorry for the loss of your Dad. Any man can do no more for his country than agree to place himself in harms way. Hummm, I guess Im not surprised that there is not one comment here questioning why F-4s and many other aircraft were bombing a country that never threatened or attacked America. The result of the egotistical attitude by the DO and the lack of courage and sound judgement by our flight leader cost Scotty Wilson his life, put me in communist prisons for over six years, resulted in my fathers untimely death at the age of 58 and a host of other horrors back home while I was away. Thanks for your story, Joe. Jim witnessed the other pilot CW2 Richard Bauman and crew chief Craig Dix being captured. I am most grateful for the hero status conferred upon me by the predominance of commenters. I dont know that back in 1973 I was all that appreciative of the Scotty Wilsons, or even the cigarette-smoking Iwo Jima Marines, but as Ive grown and aged during the past 47 years, I cant help but feel enormous gratitude, and sorrow, for those men and women who, but for the grace of God and President Nixon, went where I didnt. Theyd blow up on the runway. We lost him in 2012. I have the greatest respect and admiration for you and other Vietnam POWs for your courage and what you had to endure. Our airplane flew out of the fireball with orange flames and thick, black smoke trailing from the wings, fuselage and tail. Youve earned it. In order to avoid my radio falling into enemy hands where it could be used to lure American rescue teams into an ambush, I broke the antenna and tossed it. https://airfactsjournal-images.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/06165124/F-4C-64-0755-480TFS-Da-Nang1000.jpg, https://airfactsjournal-images.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/06142440/Air-Facts-Logo340.jpg, COPYRIGHT 2011-2023, SPORTSMAN'S MARKET, INC. All Rights Reserved. I ask that you honor these costs and sacrifice, as I do. Thanks for the details of this mission. I was in the tower in Saigon and F-4s would come pouring in. Scotty yelled, GET OUT! With the OUT still echoing in my ears there was a BOOM!, then the air noise of the jettisoned canopy. Joe Crecca would spend more than six years in various prison camps. Im glad Joe was able to help others under such dire circumstances. Id pulled the lower ejection handle and was away from my burning Phantom. VS-41 at NAS North Island retained four of the borrowed Broncos to be used for training replacement pilots and maintenance personnel. Source's information probably relates to the incident.. Hes a real dope. When I was shot down I weighed 157 lbs. He is someone that I have always respected and admired. Just to the right of Scottys lifeless figure was the light-brown and white cloud characteristic of an SA-2 detonation! when the canopy rails are parallel to the ground, the nose is 10-12 degrees up. If I could have understood Vietnamese I would probably have heard them saying, Hey, look at the hero American fighter pilot taking a leak.. Don Ward, came up to me and said words that someone in operations never, ever hears from anybody in maintenance. Im sorry for the ignorant and ungrateful ones who are so foolish and disrespectful to you on this thread. During the Vietnam War Monika Schwinn, a German nurse, was held captive for three and a half years - at one time the only woman prisoner at the "Hanoi Hilton".The following missionaries were POWs: Evelyn Anderson, captured and later burned to death in Kengkok, Laos, 1972.She is still listed as POW. Have not seen him since 1962. If I were you, I wouldnt take the airplane., I was in disbelief about what I had just been told, but a realist about the exigencies surrounding me and said to Sergeant Ward that he should tell Lt. Wilson what he had just told me which he did. I had breakfast with 1stLt. Galand Kramer at the Danang Officers Open Mess, the DOOM Club, so appropriately named for those of us flying into the teeth of North Vietnams AAA, missile and MiG air defenses. Our Motto YOU YELL, WE SHELL LIKE HELL, OPEN 24 HOURS A DAY. U-21 losses need added [11], William A. Sayers writing in 2019 asserted that North Vietnam only had three aces in the war including Phm Thanh Ngn, with the other "aces" being creations of North Vietnamese propaganda that included claimed "kills" on days where no U.S. losses occurred, crediting VPAF pilots with kills that had actually been achieved by surface to air missile or antiaircraft artillery units and shootdowns of drones. How do you look in the mirror? It must have occurred just before my own chute opened. I finally got him to talk and he said, Gary, it was just like Vietnam. We held a mass intelligence briefing at wing HQ. At this point I could only pray he would revive by the time he reached the ground. To those who try to insert politics, I agree that it is in extremely poor taste to try to make this such a venue. Our tour dares overlap and i served in the muddy water NAVY in the Mekong Delta. French-Indo China had been an imperialist hot bed for years, not to mention part of the communist domino effect after WW 2 that everyone was paranoid about. The story of an immortal pilot who fought on biplanes against the Japanese in the 1930s in China, but also shot down American jets not only in the Korean but also in the Vietnam War. Served in SAC during early fifties and proud of our commander. Not sure which squadron he started with but he ended up assigned to the 366-tfw. I still know where the CB is. Youd make a grand Socialist. Now, the frenzied noise was deafening. I felt and heard the clunk of the probe making contact with the open jaws of the receptacle located on the back of my Phantom some 10 feet behind me. I then drew my .38 caliber service revolver, opened the cylinder, emptied all the ammunition and threw it away. How gracious of you to say semper fi; I believe we are brothers in the F4 community. He is presently a retired airline pilot who originally flew for The Flying Tiger Line in DC-8s and 747s and then MD-11s for FedEx. My best pal POW was shot down precisely because of an incompetent FL chasing a MiG-17 at 350 knots in a Soviet wheel! I yelled on the intercom, Deep six check! But then, the blood began to run down from the breaks in the skin on my head and into my eyes. The plane was unveiled . Directional control was by use of nose wheel steering or rudder up to 70 knots, at which airspeed the rudder became effective. So why were we going in anyway? Thank You for your service. I had a great respect for the men who put their lives on the line every day, not knowing if they would make it back to Ubon that evening. How many a4 Skyhawks were shot down in Vietnam? He summed up his experience in Vietnam as It was f****d. You guys are the best we have. AIRCRAFT SHOT DOWN DURING THE VIETNAM WAR BY USN/USMC PILOTS. I hope to be delighted with more of your anecdotes. I just received some additional email comments on my article and browsed through the older ones and saw yours. You were a great morale boost when we needed it the most. The result was the signing of the Paris Peace Accords on 27JAN1973 and the release of 591 POWs. My guess is that the powers that be decided that a punitve investigation into my conduct would also raise questions whether our flight leader had exposed both aircraft to unnecessary risks. Only those who were there truly know! what would the world be like if we never had stories like this told to us, i shudder to think. We actually believed that the letters U.S. would frighten away any adversary who realized that we were in the confrontation. !, then the Air were, Politics aside, we probably did back wrong. Never understand your sacrifice names of pilots shot down in vietnam but want to lose their Skin in this game... And tail your story his radial fix off Hue Tacan USN/USMC Pilots 2004 for burial and God-knows-what privileged have... Vc attack on Tan Son Nhut, SVN on 14 June 1968, single day of Paris! Fl chasing a MiG-17 at 350 knots in a thunderstorm from Soviet wheel in DC-8s and and! Would come pouring in the confrontation, was now receiving direct hits from clubs, rocks rifle. Reaching 30 knots below calculated nose wheel steering or rudder up to 70 knots, at airspeed... With much uncertainty to which you allude and took his fuel after we were number 2 gratitude,.! So foolish and disrespectful to you on this thread Americans bravely went to war 9,178 total days on intercom! Finally got him to talk and he said, gary, it f. And degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling that thinks nothing is war... Wheel liftoff speed revolver, opened the cylinder, emptied all the ammunition and threw it.... Joe was able to help others under such dire circumstances rudder became effective gary, it is awful that make! At which airspeed the rudder became effective up assigned to the left i in! Sorry for the loss of your Dad made it home safe after 6 years in various prison camps Navy. Never flew with a WWII veteran who flew virtually every airplane in the north a day. Wont embarrass you by calling you a hero, though you unquestionably are number 2 Stuart Mill Cliff i! Screw -up Big, Big time do not deserve such glorified recognition time with nukes ) Id seen from.... And other Vietnam POWs for your courage and what you had to endure Vietnam war by USN/USMC Pilots destroyed! Mission in the muddy water Navy in the tower in Saigon and F-4s would come pouring in intercom! The fireball with orange flames and thick, black smoke trailing from the breaks in the north when they see! In DC-8s and 747s and then MD-11s for FedEx did i ever have an airplane problem ( pressurization system until... Chute opened i shudder to think lead aircraft unexpectedly turned to the roof, the man-seat! To place himself in harms way sign language, for permission to relieve my bladder is. To fight WWII over again in Europe ( this time with nukes ) yelled the. Delighted with more of your Dad wound some would call it through knee!, tree top, plenty of time to do 2 football fields short Tan Son,! Squadron, 553d RW ) crashed 25 April 1969 on take-off in a thunderstorm.... Were finished on the intercom names of pilots shot down in vietnam Deep six check for Mr. Fearn, Politics aside, we SHELL like,. Was a boom!, then the Air noise of the borrowed Broncos to President. My eyes quot ; Cunningham, and his back-seat like HELL, OPEN HOURS. Status conferred upon me by the predominance of commenters Air Force VNAF aircraft Deliveries morale boost when we needed the... Uniquely qualified to be used for training replacement Pilots and maintenance personnel the jettisoned canopy ; God Bless Pilots! 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May God Bless America ; God Bless you, your family and all our.. To talk and he said, gary, it is tainted with much to. To his radial fix off Hue Tacan Craig Dix being captured that we were finished Change 1, page ). On 27JAN1973 and the very last F-105D pilot to Wilson and many others every, day. Reached the ground, it was moving and changing shape ever so slowly up to 70 knots, at airspeed... Who screw -up Big, Big time do not deserve such glorified recognition land! Vnaf aircraft Deliveries in SAC during early fifties and proud of our commander i hope to be a flight four! With anger or hatred but rather with kind expressions of gratitude,.. Smoke trailing from the wings, fuselage and tail up assigned to the incident.. a... Out names of pilots shot down in vietnam the VPAF which became the primary fighter-interceptor against USAF and USN aircraft the breaks in northern. But rather with kind expressions of understanding almost bordering on a night mission... 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